Apc GrooveBox XL

[nay-seven]

A fun GrooveBox for the Apc Mini,

-Velocity set by fader,
-Pitch, gain and start position of each sampler,
-Sample choice in the list,
-16 presets possible by the apc,
-8 buses (binds) to set On/Off some FX's patches or plug-ins, all with the apc, and more...

note: you must set you Apc MIDI out device to Motorized

Thanks to the usersThomas Chamotte for ideas and debuging, and Drakh for apc scripts.

Video overview : https://vimeo.com/232225617

[drakh]

oh will try it whan i will have some time

[thomaschamotte]

Hello Nay,

i'm using you APC Groove Box XL since months know.

I did some modifications. For exemple i have changed the sampler with Recorders Sampler Grain and i have puted a mute button for any sampler in the "parent control panel".

Now in my works it's time to play with the effects and there is two things i would like to know.

First i would like to use the 'Panel LFO" of Usine with one of your Binds, but i can't because the value of the binds is 0 or 1 like a switch. I don't understand how to applic this Fx with the APC.

And second,
Do you think it's possible to creat special binds only for the sampler one and two ?
Because i would like to apply the Pan LFO just on one or two samplers max.
So For the moment i have created a Stereo Audio Bus Going out of the Sampler n°1. I didn't apply the polyphonie.
I Take the Bus to the Audio Stereo In of the Pan LFO Patch.
And when i want the effect i Mute the Sampler n°1 goine to the Pan LFO with the Bus.
When i don't want the effect i mute the rack of the Pan LFO...
Not Very Convenient.

Do you think of something more easier to use ?

Thank you for reading.

[nay-seven]

hello,
glad you appreciate this patch, ( so you still use Usine as demo for this ? )

about the binds, yes they are from the apc pads, so they are switch ( 0-1) and can be used to put an FX On-Off, for the Pan Lfo patch, you can drag this bind on its on/off green triangle ?

about the second question, best way is to open the sub-patch seqline and set the once in poly option of the 2 audio out modules to Off, apply polyphony , then you'll have multi outs and can create different fx's for each ones.

[thomaschamotte]

hello,
glad you appreciate this patch, ( so you still use Usine as demo for this ? )

about the binds, yes they are from the apc pads, so they are switch ( 0-1) and can be used to put an FX On-Off, for the Pan Lfo patch, you can drag this bind on its on/off green triangle ?

about the second question, best way is to open the sub-patch seqline and set the once in poly option of the 2 audio out modules to Off, apply polyphony , then you'll have multi outs and can create different fx's for each ones.

What do yu mean Usine as demo ?

Thank you

[nay-seven]

maybe there's an explanation i don't remember but you appear to not have license with this account ( you are a simple "member" on this forum.

[thomaschamotte]

Somewhere there is a mistake, because i have my "Lakanal Certificat" about Usine Training i have made with Olivier Sens.
And he gave us the License at the same time.
How can i fixe this ?

[nay-seven]

ok, you receive a key, so it's quiet normal, don't worry

[thomaschamotte]

If i want to root to A or to B with a button,
Do you know how called the Module who says :
When you go to the A the B is cut off
When you go to the B the A is cut off
?

[thomaschamotte]

Ho, it must be the Audio Mix dispatch

[thomaschamotte]

Hello Nay,

I have a question about your APC Groove XL.
I would ike to know if there is a posibility for the Pitch and the Gain to be Write in the Preset.
Because when i write a preset with a Pitch Value and an other preset with an other pitch valu,
the preset i call keep the last pitch value i touched.

Do you know how to do it ?

Thank you for reading.

[thomaschamotte]

And it is the same for the start position

In fact i would like to record every positions in the presets.

Can i do this ?

[thomaschamotte]

And i would like to know if the value velocity is in DbSPL too... sorry for all those little questions

[nay-seven]

to record in presets, open the option window, and right click the knobs and faders used for midi learn and in their settings panel, activate the "saved in preset" option
about velocity, the classic MIDI values ( 0-127) is used, then i convert it via a change scale module ( called Chng Scale gain in the sub-patch seqline

[thomaschamotte]

Thank you !
This is a picture of what i did to control a "Pan" in any samplers. It's very convenient.

I don't know why but the stability of the patch was brittle this morning.
A change of the pitch for no reason and locked in a new position...
I continue to work on it. And i come back to yu if the problem happen again.

I have an other question and it's more personnel.
I have read your Bio here and i seen your artworks on your tumblr but i did'nt found you on the instagram or twitter.
Where can i follow you to see what you do ?

Thanks.

[nay-seven]

Yes, feel free to inform me about bugs

Thanks for your interest in my artwork, sadly days are too short recently to maintain instagram, but you can find me on facebook and tweeter but facebook is the best place for my painting/videos

[thomaschamotte]

Cool !

[thomaschamotte]

Hello Nay,

I'm always working with your patch and the APC-Mini.
I've made a lot of modifications in the patch, but, they are simples. I put a LFO for any Pitchs Value and Bus's for Panoramic externals patches.
Now your patch is truly in the center of my work.
So much so that i have bought an other APC-mini. And i work with two patches at the same time.
But because there are two now, i have some problems.
It is about the communication with the script and the Midi channel.
I think you know now how much i'm new in the Usine game and i don't see clearly what i have to do, what i have to change in the patch to create the good communication, i tried but after many many hours on it, i didn't succeed

Can you help me and unlock me ?

My configuration is:
First APC
Device = Channel 2
Midi Learn = Channel 2

Second APC
Device = Channel 3
Midi Learn = Channel 3

This is the link of the patch i use. It works very well alone.
http://www.sensomusic.org/forums/uploads.php

Thanks for reading.

[thomaschamotte]

Hello Nay,

I would like to know how you use your patch in a different Midi Channel Tha n the Channel 1.

Because if you decide to use an other Midi Channel the only thing who fail the test of change is the CTRL Change 56.
This note take the control of code 2 of the Notes "NOTE OFF/ON 56 to 63; 48 to 55; 40 to 47; 32 to 39".
The Scripte change those notes into "NOTE OFF/ON 0 to 7; 16 to 23; 40 to 47; 48 to 39".

The Modulation of the "CTRL Change 56" Appears in the matrix as a "Cells Val" and change the value of the note locked 0 to 7; 16 to 23; 40 to 47; 48 to 39.

I know my problem is :
When i move the Midi device in Channel 2, I loose the control of the "CTRL Change 56".
But i can't identify the problem...

Maybe it's in the scritpe but i don't know well to read it.

Can you help me please i'm locked the head in the patch since three days...

[nay-seven]

For the second Akai device, add a midi transformer module directly in your MIDI device in ( open it from your device panel), then set it to channel =1, this way the patch will work normally without change, then if this device receive also on chan 3, ( but i don't think so ? ) do the same for the device MIDI out, add a transformer, and set it channel=3.

[thomaschamotte]

It doesn't work. And by the way why is the difference between puting a Midi Transf Modul in the MIDI device IN and change the Channel of this Device ? Is the same...

In an other channel everything can works well and i know how to do to let the patch works well in an other channel than the channel 1. But it's not my problem.

The only one thing who doesn't work is the Velocity controlled by the CTRL Change 56.

Ok. First Step.
I use two diffrent Akai.
First channel 1. Second channel 2.
Everything work well, i change the midi learn and it's good.

But the CTRL Change 56 Note control at the same time the two Akais.
And there is only the CTRL Change 56 form the Akai first Midi Channel who works.

For exemple. If i put the akai in Channel 2 and the other one in channel 3.
Either of the two CTRL Change 56 from any Akai works.

Because something control the "Array Modul Value" in the Matrix sub patch to say to the CTRL Change 56 : " You only work in the channel 1. But you can control any NOTE of any Channel.

Do you gat it ?
I can try to explain my self with pictures. Or i can do a video to explain my self... What do you want ?

Try your patch in channel 2 and let me know what you think about it.

[thomaschamotte]

But at the same time, if you try it with the channel 2 because you use only one Akai it doesn't matter. It's gonna work for you...

Ok, i will try to explain myself better.

[nay-seven]

back to base, why 2 different midi channels ?
your device are recognized as different devices, right ? and with different names?
when you check a midi learn , do you see different midi devices name ?
in the MIDI setup do you have deactivate MIDI feedback to all devices ?

the problem with velocity is i hack the system, when you press the shift button, the midi learn change of midi channel, this way the knob have 2 fonctions.
check the knob which control the X of the XY module in the seqline sub patch

[thomaschamotte]

Exactly you are true.
I have the APC Midi (1) and the APC Midi (2).
I'm using a midi footswitch with amplitude VST and unfortunally Amplitube can only works on the channel 1.
That's why i need to use the two akai in a different channel than the 1.


Why two different midi channels.
Because the CTRL Change 56 control at the same time the velocity of the two Akai.

For exemple.
1 - i plug the two Akai
2 - i creat two racks and put inside two APC Groove Patchs
3 - I put the APC Midi device In and Out (1) in rack 1. The APC Midi device In and Out (2) in rack 2.
4 - The two APC are in the channel 1
5 - I try. and look the TRACE
5a. For the APC Mini(1) i press: MIDI in : NOTE ON (144) - 40 - 127 (Chan=1)/ MIDI in : NOTE OFF (128) - 40 - 127 (chan=1)
The note of the matrix in te patch of the APC MINI(1) light and black. It's works well because the same note in the APC MINI Patch 2 stay black.
5.b i do exactly the same thing with the APCMini (2). It works very well.
6 - I put the the Device Midi of the Two APC in Channel 2. And i do the same thing. It works !

Know.
7 - In this position : NOTE ON (144) - 40 - 127 (Chan=2)/ MIDI in : NOTE OFF (128) - 40 - 127 (chan=2) of the two APC. In the matrix, the note Light.
8 - I try the Velocity with the APC 1. Nothing. I try the velocity with the APC 2. Nothing.
9 - I back the devices system of the two channel in Channel 1. NOTE ON (144) - 40 - 127 (Chan=1)/ MIDI in : NOTE OFF (128) - 40 - 127 (chan=1) of the two APC.
10 - I try the velocity. NOTHING.... it's so strange.

Ok. I stop everything and restart Usine.
I do exactly the same things untill the step number 5.

5 - I try. and look the TRACE
5a. For the APC Mini(1) i press: MIDI in : NOTE ON (144) - 40 - 127 (Chan=1)/ MIDI in : NOTE OFF (128) - 40 - 127 (chan=1)
The note of the matrix in te patch of the APC MINI(1) light and black. It's works well because the same note in the APC MINI Patch 2 stay black.
5.b i do exactly the same thing with the APCMini (2). It works very well.

6. I stay in the channel 1 and try the velocity. Nothing happen...

I'm sorry Nay... I'm writing at the same time i execute my actions and it's the first time the velocity doesn't work at all...
I don't understand anything now...

[thomaschamotte]

Ok it works again....

SO !
I do until the step 5.
6. In the Step 6 i don't change the channel and try the velocity !
The velocity of the Akai 1 control the velocity of the TWo akai. The velocity of the Akai 2 control anything.

7. I put every Akai in channel 2. And i try the velocity of the Akai 1. exactly the same as the step 6.

But NOW ! I'm pretty shure something stay the velocity locked in the control of the two akai even if i change the channel.

[thomaschamotte]

I know this knob control the velocity and when you press Shift it controls the master gain of the akai.
But i don't need the master gain of the patch. Maybe it could be a solution ?

[thomaschamotte]

And about your last post, this knob for velocity is not in the seq Sub patch...
Knobs in this patch only control pitch and gain.
Deosn't it ?

[nay-seven]

yes, try to disconnect the channel inlet and recreate your midilearn

[thomaschamotte]

It's down.

In channel 1, the velocity fader of the Akai 1 control the velocity of the two akai. The velocity of the Second Akai control nothing.
In channel 2, The velocity fader control nothing.

[thomaschamotte]

Nop ?

[thomaschamotte]

hello nay,
have you find something ?

[thomaschamotte]

What is the channel Inlet ?

[thomaschamotte]

I found something and it's one more step to the success.

When the two akai are pluged and Akai 1 in channel 2 and Akai 2 in Channel 3.
If i put the Midi Learn Of the "B" Knob of Matrix Sub/Sub Patch in channel 2 it's works only for the Akai 1.
If i put the Midi Learn Of the "B" Knob of Matrix Sub/Sub Patch in channel 3 it doesn't work.
And the same for any channel. The akai 2 doesn't reconigze the CTRL 56...

[thomaschamotte]

What does mean the option "soft take over " ?

[nay-seven]

about soft take over, remember Usine has a manual ? check this page

About your problem, you have to understand that even if you modify the midi channel in the rack input, when you create a midi learn, Usine will use the real device anyway ( in this case always channel 1)

so there 's a module to solve this , its the midi output to Usine module ( find it in modules/input/otput/additionnal)

add it after your first MIDI input in the main patch:

this way your MIDI learn will be receive on the good channel

Now you need to modify the invisible knob you found for velocity:


tell me if it's ok for you

[thomaschamotte]

Ok,

I understand what you mean.
I have followed every steps of your post and it doesn't work.

[nay-seven]

Your MIDI device is set to channel 2 ?

[thomaschamotte]

Yes...

[nay-seven]

strange

[nay-seven]

Here a version of my add-on, but this time i don't use the midi channel hack for velocity, but direct link from the device ( look at the multi filer just after the MIDI in Module)
try it and tell me if it's work for you and specially with 2 apc instances:
Download

[thomaschamotte]

Hello Nay,

I just trie your new patch with the velocity directly connected.

It's working very well.

Thank you.

[thomaschamotte]

But in the subpatch Sequline you have to change the Knob X because he stays locked in the channel 1 with the X+1 module.

[thomaschamotte]

Ho and the sub patch size who control the size of the beats doesn't work anymore...

[nay-seven]

First purpose was to test the velocity fader as you ask for this, i don't have change anything to other sub patch
do you mean the shift+ first fader dont change sample position when you have 2 instances ?

[thomaschamotte]

No,
In the seq sub patch there is the Knob X who control the pitch. And the Knob Y control the gain.
Because a X+1 module come in the Knob X module, the midi learn doesn't work on an other channel than the 1.

[nay-seven]

i have to find another solution for the size , works only on 4/4 mode in the master synchro..

[nay-seven]

about the knob X, try to replace the x+1 by a A*B module and set B to 2

[nay-seven]

if it works for fader 1, apply polyphony to the sub patch

[thomaschamotte]

It works with the modul * with B = 2
I'm doing the same thing with the channel 3 of the other APC.

[thomaschamotte]

But it can works only if the SHIFT button is on a Toogle position.
Because if the Shift Button is on absolut the default position is the "Start position" and not the pitch.
When the shift is off, the channel is 0 and control the start position
When the Shift is on, the channel is 2 and control the pitch.
But it is not confortable.

[thomaschamotte]

But when the shift is locked because he is on the toogle position, the velocity is not the default CTRL, it is the Main Volume.
So it is not confortable too...

[nay-seven]

ok, will try to use direct MIDI link also for this
but tomorrow

[thomaschamotte]

Yes
See you.

[nay-seven]

ok, so not many free time recently
here maybe a solution, velocity is in direct mode , other are in midi learn (no need to change it on your side)
2 different patches, named respectively chan 2 and chan 3
test it
Download

[thomaschamotte]

Nice move on the "XKnob" modul in the Sequ Subpatch !
It works very well.

But there is something else who doesn't work and i can't figure it out...
The "Size" sub patch put out the good values of the APC Notes, but the "Fader" module receive nothing.
I don't understand the A=B B=86 in the Size subpatch...

[thomaschamotte]

I figure out an other thing who is not confortable.

When you change a value of a note with the velocity button.
- If you use the Shift button with the volume button
The volume automatically take the same value of the last velocity value.

So when you play and choose a value, and after use de main volume you can be surprised...

[nay-seven]

ok, so all must be fixed now, back to first method to not loose the soft take over
for the size, i've improve it, B=86 correspond to the red button where you change length sequence

here 2 patches , one for each channel, all midi learn done
Download

[thomaschamotte]

Hello Nay-Seven how are you ?

I've found a bug with the APC Groove who is very inconvenient.
But maybe it is not a bug.
Maybe it's just something i've missed.

It is about the presets.
When i work and i write on a preset the APC Groove XL create either a new preset or come to the preset n° 1 and erase your work ...
But don't write on a preset who is working on.
Sometimes it works but it's one of a hundreds.

Because the manipulation is really inconvenient at the end when you work you don't follow it.
Either you loose your work in the process, or you finish your session with 100 prsets or more...

Can you help on this ?

Thank you.

[nay-seven]

Can't reproduce this...

to be sure :
new: create a new preset with current parameters.
write: write or overwrite the current preset in 1 Clic.
rewrite : need 2 clics, one to activate the rewrite, then clic on the preset number you want rewrite.