MIDI Sampler - Expansion

[sephult]

Hello!

Something I wanted to have added that I think would expand the MIDI Sampler a bunch:

Array access to gain, pitch, and other parameters....... maybe be cool for random and reset pitch array too.
Length parameters would be extremely awesome too, an array of start and one of the stop.....

I always thought this would make the MIDI Sampler have the ability to become more dynamic.

-s

[sephult]

Would also be cool to have some indication of the mapped MIDI Notes used
Say if C1 through D2 was used and loaded....An array or comma of the notes might be useful.
This way you could somehow parse and use for auto-assignment of MIDI Notes on other devices, such as sequencers, etc..

[damstraversaz]

I'm agree. There is a lot of external vst sampler on the market , but having a internal sampler with usine is often useful. I'm missing too more controls for each file ( volume ADSR for exemple), a round robin option... of course that's just suggestions to the team.

[SylvainT]

Putting an ADSR module is very simple.
The round robin option is possible too, and very simple to patch. I use that idea a lot. For each sample you want to use round robin option, just load your different samples and select for file selection mode "random file" instead of "single file".

All the Best

Sylvain

[damstraversaz]

yes, this is possible. I was not clear, sorry, I was thinking about more options per sample. There is actually some limitations : for exemple ,if I remember, the random mode works fine for short sounds for exemple. But you can't choose a start and end point for each sound. So all sounds must be edited perfectly and that's not really easy to deal with short and long sounds for the same key.
Some more advanced sampler give you an start/end function, adrs module , volume for each sample and all this features could be very useful in my opinion.
I perfectly understand that this is the first goal of the midi sampler to do this.

[sephult]

Yes damstraversaz...during making banks I was really wanting an external way to control the start and stop of the individual samples loaded (externally)
I really like to have moving/animated sounds that vary over time....some more humanization.

The pitch stuff I am glad is in there. Same with the randomize lists. So I use this with my kick/Sn bank which loads a ton of just kick and snares.
When I am just wanting to experiment and try to find a set I like I randomize the lists to get different variations. I think there was the percussion one that
got in there too.

These can be very useful for some creative-generating. They aren't up-front because of worry of messing up the banks during performance. So you have to edit and add them
in your patch.

"Some more advanced sampler give you an start/end function, adrs module , volume for each sample and all this features could be very useful in my opinion."

-This is all available in the midi-sampler now (except ADSR...which I like the idea). if you click the individual samples in the bank then the sample should show and you can modify the start and stop.
In the settings panel too you can modify the gain in a stereo L/R, and individual pitch as well....I've just been buggin for external access of all of these.
Definitely want to evolve the MIDI Sampler.

I would really love a "Grain-MIDI Sampler" with grain options on each sample!
I know I can do this with a Sub-patch polyphony...but just seems logical since all of the MIDI Sampler interfacing is already there.

Spent a lot of time with the MIDI Sampler, love to see it evolve.

-s

[damstraversaz]

thanks for the fedback, it seems that I need to take some time with the midi sampler. In any case, I'm believe this is one of the most important module for usine and I love to see it evolve too.

[sm_jamieson]

For the midi sampler, I suppose if you added re-tuning of samples over several notes, and the ability to loop a sample (start / end loop points) you would have the basis of a sample playback synth.

[damstraversaz]

I'm agree, the more useful function could be to have all of this for each sample, and not for each key, as actually there is one sampler per key with pitch, volume, start end control. But I think it will be a new rebuilt.
There is actually some workaround for this , with multiple midi sampler, using piano roll and midi dispatcher.

[sm_jamieson]

Yes, on each sample.

In fact there are some variations of the WAV file format that include loop points. This JUCE forum message talks about it:
https://forum.juce.com/t/wav-file-loop-points/12387
I think you can also specify multiple looping points, which you could use with a round robin to make the samples sound
less static.

Then you can use an external editor to prepare the loop points, just need Usine to have an option to use them.

Of course would be possible to produce a user module for sample playback.
I'm not sure of the algorithm to re-tune notes in real-time though. Like re-rendering at a different resolution.
I wonder it there is a module written with the SDK that includes that function ...

[oli_lab]

another alternative would be to save the markers into a file. that could be done with a script.
il you give the same name to this file as the wavefile, it's easy to retrieve both on loading
(for exemple trumpet.wav and trumpet.mkr)

[sephult]

Curious about the tuning/retune....Although you can individually change the pitch of each sample...there is the overall pitch, which can be used.
Not sure if this was what you were talking about, but this can be found on the pop-up. There is also an Ignore MIDI OFF. Wanted to be able to play the full sample when triggered or respond to a note off. I specifically like to switch between, I use a transform length to cut alter my overall drumkit or banks length for a short choppy sound.

Now that I am thinking about the ignore note...would be cool to have option per sample. Like a trigger (Note On/Off),one-hit-full (ignore note Off), loop-toggle, loop x times, etc...these would be cool editions.

-s

[sm_jamieson]

I hadn't used the midi sampler much and I didn't release all it could do.

So it does re-tuning to use a sample over several notes, and velocity ranges. And also has a start and end point on the wave.

So it just needs an additional pair of lines that specify a loop start and end point. Additionally it could support several pairs of lines for different loop points that could be chosen round robin or random.

A synth would also have ADSR envelope and filters per note, which is more of a problem in a patch since they need to be triggered per note. Maybe polyphony can be used to do something clever there - I don't know. But that is a feature that would be required for any polyphonic synth.

If you want a full feature sample playback synth you could just use a VSTi, but something extra is there using Usine's internal functions.

Simon.

[sephult]

Also I was going through and thought that it would be extremely useful to have the samples list on an output node as well.
Maybe a trigger index would also be useful. This way you could display the sample names if you wanted for the midi channel, and/or indicate the
sample externally of the MIDI Sampler that is currently being triggered.

Seems quite useful to me, any thoughts?

-s

[sephult]

haha they just keep coming.

Multi-Bus Outputs. All samples go to the main outs, but there could be like 2-4 more pairs, where you could assign a single sample output to this for processing individually.
Oh and I didn't remember if I said this before...The Note Range (I think I mentioned above). This way you could range your objects accordingly


-s

[senso]

hi,
interesting discussion.
I have added an Attack-time parameter for samples in the v155. I hope It will help.

For other suggestions, like array input for pitches, etc. I need time to find a more global solution to export all parameters of complex modules like that.

Internally, the MidiSampler is made of a Manager-module (the MIDIsampler itself) which contains sampler modules created dynamically according the number of current voices.

I expect to be able to export all the settings of the dynamic samplers as in/outlet of the Manager-module which is not easy. We have the same problem with, for example, speakers of the Surround-panner module.

I'll probably change some important stuffs in the engine that's why I need time. I hope in HH3.5 or HH4.

[damstraversaz]

great! thanks a lot for the feedback.

[springreverb]

HI,
Could someone please post a patch of how you randomize a sample on each midi trigger, using the internal MIDI sampler?

Only got Usine a couple of days ago, very excited about the possibilities, been trying to do this for a couple of hours and not getting anywhere, would really appreciate a kick start!

Im going for a round robin situation for drum samples, so you get a different sample every time the midi key is triggered.
So can you have say a drum kit with multiple samples per drum sound all in one MIDI sampler instance?
Ive read the manual several times, put lots of samples into the list but can't seem to get the randomize list function to do anything?
Thank you.

[x.iso]

Each sample is mapped to a note, so what you actually need is to intercept note messages and recreate them with random note.
here's example workspace http://www.sensomusic.org/forums/upload ... xample.wkp
EDIT: sorry, forgot to set MIDI Filter ON to actual Note ON messages ðŸ˜￾ so set the filter to Note ON there.

you could also replace Random Note On generator with MIDI step sequence array and create you own pattern that will go off one step per note input. In this example I've made some extra patching to generate Note OFF messages in time with input midi, otherwise there's no note off or you can just put MIDI transformer and set the fixed note lenght

[springreverb]

HI,
Thanks so much for that, good to see a complex patch like that early on, Im very appreciative

Trouble is though its not doing a round robin thing and is REALLY overly complex but getting a VERY simple result.

What is needed is this, 1 example.
---
One drum kit, let's say an analogue 909 or an acoustic kit.
10 different kick drum samples of the same sound
25 snare samples
8 Clap samples
25 hihat samples
8 low toms
8 mid toms
8 high toms

etc
---

This would take forever and even then you would get it repeating sounds.
It would literally take under a minute to setup in FL studio's FPC, which is uber simple, drag multiple samples on top of a drum pad and hit the random or round robin option.

Is there no actual way of randomising the sounds? the random list button works but you have to manually hit it, i couldnt see how you could trigger it with a MIDI note on?
It seems like it would be super easy to add this so the list is randomised or just stepped through sequentially?
Then no patching is required at all.
This function could also then be used to sequence loads of different wavecycles as well as drum samples, ez to setup and great complex results can be had in seconds.

[nay-seven]

hello and Welcome Spingreverb,

Here a patch example

Edit ok, did'nt see the X-iso answer and your precisions

[nay-seven]

Here a new simple one :
Download

and for info, there's a mode Random in the file selection/mode of the module

[nay-seven]

And a simpler one with the MIDI sampler
Download

How to:
click on each item/ select random( 1) and create your list (2)